Page 253
February 21st, 2011

Page 253

The reformation of team Lecherous Evil can only lead to mayhem…

So I love talking politics but I generally keep it out of stuff like the comic (too much of a downer!) but something happened last week that I never thought possible: I agreed with Justin Bieber.  In general Bieber is a non-entity in my life; I can’t name any of his song titles nor have I ever heard one in it’s entirety but some of the stuff he said in that Rolling Stone article was interesting (I’ll admit I haven’t read the whole thing, just the highlights!)  I don’t think he chose his words very carefully when asked if he’d ever become an American citizen but I completely agree with him on the craziness of living in a situation where you could lose your house because you got sick or hit by a car or something.  That has never happened in Canada, and hopefully never will.  Sure our system has it’s drawbacks and occasional wait times (I have yet to experience any really) and the next few years of aging baby boomers are going to be interesting but I really can’t imagine living in a country where I can’t have a baby until I save up first.

When I was pregnant with Sam we went to Anime Boston and had dinner with some US friends.  One was local and as I understand it Massachusetts has stricter policies about health care access for students and low income people so she was in a better place than the others.  We’re all a bunch of free lance artists so I imagine that means pretty crappy health insurance on average?  We priced out what it could cost us to have Sam in the US and it varied widely from state to state in the $3000-15000 range.  And that was for a normal delivery with NO complications (a C sec could apparently double or even triple that).  Considering twins are always early, sometimes dangerously so, and one day in a NICU could cost in the tens of thousands for one baby… well what do you do in that situation?  Start leveraging your house??  Hopefully I’m just ignorant of the real situation and US readers can let me know in the comments but the whole idea terrifies me.

So now I’m rambling but the gist of this is that I suddenly developed some respect for Justin Bieber.  I always figured he was a highly managed puppet star but I guess he actually has a mind to speak with.  He may have unwisely alienated some US fans where I imagine the bulk of his ticket and cd sales come from and his next interview will probably be scripted… but good for him.  I think the abortion question rattled him though (who in the hell asks a 16 year old pop star about that anyway??)  Oh and he totally didn’t deserve a Grammy, come on.  Awards are generally dumb but they should be given to those artists who can at least write and perform their own stuff and not just their own dance moves… sheesh.  And Arcade Fire rocks.

Enough with the serious: a recent Gimp commission for one of my most eloquent fans :)


  1. Nicole

    @JS: I’m sure that would go over SO well! ;)

  2. kitsunekage

    @ admin I’m pretty sure that they had more than enough computers to handle the influx of ticket buyers. also that was just a rumour I heard, so it may have been 22 minutes. (Though that is still fairly fast!)

    @ Blacky Blackerson 1) Good luck in your resisting 2) I’m pretty much the same with my tastes in music, although I perfer bands like Hemmerfall and DragonForce, with a bit of Metallica and Amon Amarth on the side. 3) If you do decide to make a tribute to BN, plaese post a link in the comments for all of us poor BN-addicts…. ;))

  3. Zero

    I’d like a Tanked vs The Dragon poll next ;) . The results might be …

  4. D-Ballz

    I’m here for the argument about health care.

    I’m English. We pay for health care out of our taxes, but if someone wants to go private, they can pay for that too. Personally, I dread to think what my health bill would be if I was American. I’d probably be homeless. See, I’m a student, for a start, and as such there is a general lack of money there. On top of this, I have some recurring health issues (knees, ears, throat, liver), and have had one hell of a lot of medical treatment in the past. If health care wasn’t paid out of taxes, then I would’ve probably bankrupted my family. On top of this, one of my cousins appears to be allergic to pretty much everything. He’s still just a baby, and his list of health issues are also probably enough to ruin a family in America.

    Still, we manage to get by because of the system in place in the UK. People here love to hate the NHS for the waiting periods, and so many other little issues, but the thing is, there are a lot more advantages than disadvantages. It honestly makes me glad i’m not American.

  5. Blacky Blackerson

    @JS: Yep ’cause everyones going to want to do that XD.

    @kitsunekage: 1) Helps to think about what would happen if I did. I need my brain to function properly). 2) Trust me, I’ll make a post because if I don’t, some BN addict (which considers this comic as crack to them) will find and maul me with the Phanny Pack of EVIL!

  6. grant N

    Ok gave it couple of days for everyone to pounce on me since I Knew it would only one I am going to answer is the Admin/creator….. God forbid that happens to you but what would happen to your family if you suffered a horrible injury and needed months of rehab and lost your job? First off great Questions I currently pay for Disablity insurance in our limited budget covered for a year……Is it fair for the bank to take your house if that happened? I rent cheaply as of now plus i also have a $6000 dollar emergancy fund aswell as a $5000 plus little bit in the HSA…….What if that happened to a friend, or neighbor? Our churchs around are pretty good about potlucks and fundraisers and if we as a country wheren’t taxed so much there would be more private money to go around…….Screw them? see previous answer…….Your tax dollars shouldn’t go to helping them, they’ll just have to get by somehow? If one is prepared you don’t need the goverment but we as a country already had safety nets in place before this BS healthcare bill. I will also say this though the brits have it figured out. Our biggest healthcare cost in this country is the elderly they just shuffle them off to “retirement homes” and stuff them with pills and hope they die waiting on the list for surgeries and treatment thanks for chiming in D-ballz………That’s the kind of thing I just can’t fathom happening to families, and yet it does. Party cuase you have been conditioned to see it that way by the nanny state you live in. And that is what kinda bothers me truely If a person living here hates how we do things in this country MOVE. save up the $15,000 citzenship for canada and move in true its not that different up there little colder than where I live true and French is printed everywhere plus they use the metric system a supriour system mind you. And it cost little more cause of the taxes partly and you just little bit farther from everything is seems.

    And although I said I would only answer admin the Tax comments are just to good pass up. Considering a good chunk of our population doesn’t pay taxes but infact get paid to breath is the problem. Also although I don’t really defending them the fact we as a country tax the richest 1% of the population around 50% of their earnings to pay for 30% of our total USA tax bill is also wrong. Not really sure if a Flat tax is the way to go since that is what we have or rather had till the jerks in DC got ahold of it and used it to buy votes to get elected year after year. Nor do I really think the Fair Tax that one of my favorite talk-show hosts Neal Bortz has a snowballs chance in hell since it takes nearly all the vote buying power away from the Jerks. somthing needs to change in taxes to make it less of a hinderance or punishment to suceed in this country before it makes sense to have “free healthcare” aswell as most of the other entilement programs.

  7. JS

    @grant N: “somthing needs to change in taxes to make it less of a hinderance or punishment to suceed in this country”

    Ahem… isn’t this an opening for a smartass to suggest you take your own advice, re, “truely If a person living here hates how we do things in this country MOVE” (I hear Saudi Arabia really takes good care of poor little rich kids)? Luckily there aren’t any smartasses around the BN board, huh? ;)

  8. Felonious Punk

    LMAO! Sorry, N, I gotta call BS. This is what happens when people get their facts from talk shows instead of actually doing some research. Since 2001 the very top tax rate has hovered at around 34%, not even close to 50%, while the lowest has stayed at around 11%.
    And that top 1% you’re so concerned about, how much of the money in the country is theirs?
    Check this out:

    Total Net Worth (2007)
    Top 1% Next 19% Bottom 80%
    34.6% 50.5% 15.0%

    Financial Wealth (2007)
    Top 1% Next 19% Bottom 80%
    42.7% 50.3% 7.0%


    Yes. The top 1% (as of 2007) have over 42% of the money in this country. Should taxation be proportional? Would it be fair if we made the bottom 80% contribute to 80% of the tax revenue? Well, that would be impossible, because EVERY DOLLAR the bottom 80% have wouldn’t come close to 80% of the tax revenue. And that’s what the flat tax asks. The top 1% – despite having over 42% of the country’s wealth – would only have to contribute to 1% of the tax revenue.

    As for illegal immigrants taking so much of our tax revenue for their healthcare and bankrupting the system? That, too, is a myth, my friend, and EASILY banished: the RAND Corporation (not known for being leftists, I might add) found that in 2000 only $1.1 billion was spent on healthcare for non-elderly illegal immigrants. That year the Congressional Budget Office put the federal healthcare spending at around $88 billion. That’s less than 2%. Education? In 2006 $28.6 billion out of over $500 billion.


    Flat tax is BS.
    The rich being unfairly milked is BS.
    Illegal immigrants stealing all our money is BS.

    What isn’t BS? I’m a college graduate (Computer Science, by the way) who hasn’t had healthcare for over a decade, despite running my own business AND working at a company. The company won’t hire anyone full-time, we’re all part-time, temps, or contractors, but I can’t quit and expand my business enough to afford healthcare for myself. I spend over $750 a month on prescriptions and around $500 a month on doctors just for myself.

    And N, please don’t just assign me into a box label ‘Liberal’ in your head and dismiss me. Because I’m not. In fact, in some ways I’m conservative, in other ways I’m a liberal. Drawing arbitrary lines and then saying ‘I agree with EVERYTHING they say and disagree with EVERYTHING the others say’ is rather simplistic, and I’ve found that if people actually think about complex issues and do some research, then they can’t just check off a box on a list and consider it all sorted.

    (Sorry so long, but I get into these arguments quite a bit with colleagues and friends [from BOTH sides] who just watch talk shows and then parrot the misinformation they’re fed. It irks me. I apologize for the length, but not the content.)

  9. kat

    THOSE TERRIBLE FIENDS!! Hopfully they left some for tanked

  10. JS

    @kat — That’s a good question… who IS Lech stealing the booze from? I was under the impression it was some restaurant in the zoo, or maybe the keepers’ lounge or something, but… is he taking it from Tanked? I don’t remember seeing Tanked with anything harder than beer, aside from the wine Gay tries to step him up to, but…

  11. Ketira

    @Admin: thanks for clearing up the image –and the laugh! I save those in the same way I save certain strips from another comic: to have a good laugh when I need one. ;)

    {rant mode on -everyone but the person named had better duck for cover- }
    @grantN — EXCUSE ME?!! I don’t take generalizations lightly, & that’s what you’re doing. What about my situation: I was born with ADHD, but the government won’t count it as a “disability” because it’s “managed” with drugs and/or other therapies. Yet the Business world has been phasing people like me out because we “cost too much” because of our inconsistencies. Right now, the Workplace is an Employer’s Market, not an Employee’s Market like it was before the economic/housing Collapse. Do you realize what that means for me?

    It means that 99.9999999…% of the time, my resume will get shredded the second I’m out the door. And if I call back to see if I can get a second interview, I’ll get told time and time again: “The position has been filled”. No, I do not qualify for Disability Assistance because how the government sees ADHD –which is old-fashioned, IMO. (They should take that case-by-case as everyone is different.) I’m not sure if I’ll qualify for Medicaid or SSI as I’ve not filed for either for this year. So where am I now?

    Living with my 70+ -year old parents, and not in a nursing home either. Dad is in remission for lung cancer (has been for at least 5 years), his back & knees are giving him problems due to the cold nights down here in Florida, and Mom is recovering from (I think) Pancreatic cancer; I’m glad that thing was (and still is since they found another mass on one of the lymph nodes) slow-growing as it took months for her to work out the Insurance end so she wouldn’t have to pay full price for the hospital stay/operation/etc.

    One other thing: before Obama’s bill became law, I couldn’t get private healthcare either because of two pre-existing conditions, which happened to me when I brought into this world. (I’ve named one already.) As long as the US Congress keeps that in the bill, I won’t mind what other compromises the Big Two come up with.

    Besides, did you know that our dear author/artist who draws this comic is Canadian? So for the Canadians, here’s the link to the child’s version of how the US government makes laws:
    (The only thing they left out of that song was this one fact: If the President vetoes a bill, it can still become law if Congress gets 2/3 of the re-vote in both Senate and House.)
    {end rant mode}

    @JS – hehehehehe… thank you for handing grantN his own words back to him! As I said – I hate people who speak in Generalities! I’m also glad this is a forum; I’ve been compared to a fire siren when I get loud, which I tend to do when I get angry….

  12. TigersBloodMagik

    Hey and congrats on the twins!! I’m expecting my second lill one in a few months. I can’t imagine living in a country where you don’t have to worry about health care. I mean, even at a younge age I can remember hearing my parents talking about saving up for a surgery or putting it off another year, and my family has always had good insurance compaired to a lot of americans.

    I work for the goverment as a electrition so nearly 80% of medical cost are covered, after I pay the $500 deductable out of pocket for each person in my family every year, then actual coverage kicks in. Even with that 80% most procedures still end up costing a few thousand dollars on my part, $3000-4000 min. With my last child I ended up paying over $6000 out of pocket that the insurance would not cover just for the hospital bill, exspecially since finding out my medical doesn’t cover prenatal care at the same 80% as the rest, its closer to 50%. So I’m always amazed to hear how your health care up there works.

    I just had my son 10 months ago and finally finished paying the hospital and doctors bills and now I’m due in three months and its gona start all over again. By the way, with a 36hr labor more then one doctor has to tend to you at the ER so there were 5 diffrent bills from 5 diffrent doctors even though only one delivered my baby. Also, in canada does the doctor you see for prenatal care actually deliver your baby? I don’t know about back east but here in california and arizona most doctors that give you the prenatual care will not be the one to deliver your baby unless they happen to be the doctor on call in a large group of doctors when you deliver. So I’m paying thousands of dollars to a doctor that probably wont be the one to deliver me and they think this is perfectly acceptable!

    Sigh, so sorry to rant but I just had to deal with finding a new doctor yesterday because my old one was messing up all my prenatal tests. Congradulation again and good luck with your twins!!!

  13. wingsofwrath

    Living in a country where births are subsidized by the state* and healthcare is available to pretty much everyone (even though in recent years the actual quality seems to be declining, because the current government has managed to really mess up the system and a lot of good doctors have decided to emigrate to other EU countries) reading about the US Healthcare system is like something out of a nightmare.
    I really can’t understand how a supposedly civilised country can be so careless with its own citizens.

    *by law. Most people also like to “slip the doctors a little something” in order to get preferential treatment, but those might be a few hundred bucks at most, nothing like the tremendous costs in the States. It’s all in the legacy of being a former Communist state.

  14. Nicole

    @wingsofwrath: “I really can’t understand how a supposedly civilised country can be so careless with its own citizens.” Um…because the governement isn’t our mommy and daddy? Again, it’s a cultural thing. I do expect the government to protect me (per the military), to take care of infrastructure like roads and electrical, to provide all with a basic education, and to care for our natural resources like the national parks. These are the things I pay taxes for. But I have never expected my government to look after my each and every personal need. It’s never been that way, so I don’t expect it. I don’t even expect that after all these years of putting money into Social Security that there will be any left for me after the baby boomers take it all and our government continues to squander it leaving nothing but IOUs in its place. I expect to have to support myself through my own savings and efforts when I am old.

    Why would I expect the government to do that? Like those of you who have always had health care provided, you can’t imagine a government that doesn’t take care of you. I can’t imagine a government that does. I’ve never seen that as the purpose of government.

    American mindset: individual autonomy is paramount. Absolutely, that mindset carries with it severe inherent risks. It means when my ship goes down, I’m responsible for it. If someone is there to help me and bail me out, great, but if not, I have to find a way to make it myself. So you build a community of family and friends and we take care of each other. I’ve paid a lot of hospital bills for friends who needed the help, and I’ve had bills paid for me. That’s what community is for, not the government. Even so, if I can’t find a way to keep my ship from going down, I go down. It’s no one’s fault; it’s just life. Valuing personal freedom like that places the onus of attaining a fulfilled life on the shoulders of each individual.

    Personally, I like what I hear from Alison about her experience with health care in Canada. Moving to that kind of a system here is not going to happen here overnight and it will take compromise from both sides and small changes one at a time. But I think it will happen. Slow and steady wins the race.

    I have yet to hear from universal health care proponents as to how we are supposed to pay for it. That question is always avoided. Again, I’m not allowed to ignore debt that I owe. Why is our government allowed to do that and still keep spending?

    Oh, Alison…did you know what a can of worms you were opening? ;) Yes, you did, you cheeky lass!

  15. kitsunekage

    @Blacky Blackerson Nah, I’d just send Vixen after you….. She’s scary.

    @Grant N Okay, Dude. 1) Get some sleep so you can type properly. If your gonna type a rant, make it readable. 2)”save up the $15,000 citzenship for canada and move in true its not that different up there little colder than where I live true and French is printed everywhere plus they use the metric system a supriour system mind you. And it cost little more cause of the taxes partly and you just little bit farther from everything is seems” It is VERY different up here! Do you know how long people have been waiting to get the medical attention that they need? People were waiting for up to a year for organ transplants, mounths for CAT scans, and weeks for simple things like a tumer removal. Granted, that was a couple of years ago when that story graced the news, but the situation hasn’t changed much. I should know, my dad has Ankolosing Spondalidis, a type of arethritis. He’s had is hip replaced several years back, and he still fies down to Vancouver to get x-rays and blood work done. (We live in Whitehorse, yukon) And guess what, It’s genetic, and I have it. Joy. Also, If you do manage to move to Canada, good luck in finding a Family doctor. Many cities, towns, even whole provinces are seriously under-staffed and need more Family doctors, and those who are there to help are virtually swamped with patients. With the American system it appears that everyone who is willing to pay for the insurience, or can shell out the cash nessisary will get the surgiuries they need within the month. So, like many befor my have ranted, do your reseach properly.
    And I do aplogise for my angery typing, But I really don’t like being reminded of my arethritis because I’m going into the trades, and it would make that kind of work next to impossible. So, thanks, A-hole.

  16. JS

    @kitsunekage — So let me see here… your dad has a relatively rare medical condition, lives in a fairly small city with a population that would fit nicely into about 20 average apartment buildings roughly a thousand miles from any city anyone outside of Canada would ever have heard of, and at the public expense, he has been sent to a different province for ongoing treatment of a condition for which he received complicated surgery (again, at the public expense)… and you’re actually BITCHING? Dude, are you serious? Honestly, go into the bathroom right now, look in the mirror, and give that guy a slap. HE NEEDS IT BAD.

  17. JS

    One other thing… this “$15,000 for Canadian citizenship” thing is faintly insulting, and should be corrected. The money that’s being bandied about here is not to “buy Canadian citizenship”. Canadian citizenship isn’t for sale. That sum is (roughly) the money you have to bring with you when you immigrate to this country is to ensure you will be able to support yourself for the first year you are resident here, and according to CIC, that’s $11,115 for a single skilled worker. The number goes up from there, of course, as you lard on dependents coming with you. $15,000 would cover two people, with a bit to spare, but not three (junior would have to stay home with grandma till you had $17,011 saved up).

  18. Blacky Blackerson

    @Everyone that this applies to: Sorry if I come off sounding a little ignorant about these subjects because, really, I’m just 17 and still being supported by Mom, but whats with some of the hostility? I mean, I know health care (or lack of it for most people) is a issue, but it feels like we’re just bashing each other. Ranting about our own personal problems isn’t going to solve anything and just will leave you open for attack by other people. Also, you have to consider that statistics vary in different areas so stating statistics in America will be wrong to those in other areas like Canada.

    And about the government, they are not here to spoon feed us. There’s also a process to get certain bills passed and conflicts happen even with each other. Salary is something you need to worry about, but some have decent salaries (especially those staying by themselves). We are at poverty level and Mom has to support me and my lil’ sis, but we make it and I have to say I live a really happy life. Yes, things are stressful, but wringing each other isn’t going to help anyone.

    Again, sorry if this comes off as idiotic or ignorant (I still have alot to learn myself); however, I just feel a scense of hostile anger towards each other. I mean, this is a comic about drunken, tarty, and sadistic bears. These pages should be filled with witty comments and at the most, events in life that don’t put each other down. This is all from the optimistic peace maker (hopefully).

  19. JS

    @Blacky — “And about the government, they are not here to spoon feed us.”

    No, but they are there to give us decent service for our tax dollars. First and foremost should be our health. If you don’t have your health, all the superhighways and airports, space shuttles and stealth lawn mowers really don’t amount to much in the scheme of things. A decent society should ensure the necessities and enable folks to shoot for the luxuries… not the other way around.

  20. Nicole

    @Blacky: It’s Alison’s fault! *points at admin* She started it! ;) Seriously, I don’t think any of us regular BN commenters are mad at each other. We have to agree to disagree on some stuff. You don’t come across as ignorant and your opinion is welcome as is everyone else’s.

    @JS: I wonder why health care wasn’t thought of first if, indeed, that should be our #1 priority. We have to deal with where we are, not where we wish we had been. The fact remains that we can’t afford universal health care. If we want it, then we need to stop funding the highways, airports, schools, etc., in order to free up the money to pay for it. We can’t just keep printing money as if the paper itself is actually worth something–it’s not.

    Sorry, but I’m a very practical person. If we can’t afford it and want it, then something else has to be cut to pay for it. But no one wants to cut anything. So we’re basically screwed.

  21. JS

    @Nicole — You really don’t need to stop funding highways, airports, and schools and stuff. We have those too. So do the Brits, the French, etc. What the rest of us don’t have is 5% of the world’s population but 50%+ of the world’s armaments. I think paring that back to something more reasonable would open up worlds of opportunities for the US both in terms of universal health care and eliminating trillion-dollar deficits. But as you say, people have to want that… more than they want to enrich McDonnell Douglas’s board and shareholders.

  22. wingsofwrath

    @Nicole – “But I have never expected my government to look after my each and every personal need” Unfortunately I have heard this repeated many times in the mouths of Americans in relation to the Medical System, and I’m afraid that is just one those things that got introduced at one point and now gets taken as gospel truth despite being an awful lie.

    Healthcare is not, by any stretch of imagination, a “personal need” or “commodity”, is something basic.

    In order for a country to function, the people in that country should all be able to do their jobs as efficiently as possible, and for this they must be fed, protected, and, more importantly, kept alive…

    To help with that, (since it’s in it’s own interest, after all) the government will provide, as you mentioned, a few services for which it will be paid with tax money: protection (in the form of police, rescue services and military to tackle external threats), education, infrastructure (roads, utilities, communication)…

    But really think of it this way – don’t you think it’s odd that the government thinks it’s important to have good roads on which it’s educated citizens will travel to enjoy all the blessings bought by affordable electricity and running water but at the same time doesn’t care wherever those people stay alive or not?

    “We preserve your individual autonomy by allowing you to die?”

    Isn’t this the thirst thing you should do, if you want to have people left to work for you?

    “Step A: make sure they live
    Step B: everything else..”

    Not to mention, that the way I’ve seen it work in the US (and I’ve seen it up close and personal, having lived in Colorado, Maryland, DC and California), the Medical system isn’t concerned with keeping people alive as much as it is with padding the coffers of those who run the Hospitals and Pharmaceutical companies.

    This, in my opinion would qualify less as preserving the “individual autonomy” of people and more like textbook state-sanctioned extortion. “You’re going to get sick eventually, and when you do, we’ve going to force you to pay our exorbitant prices, because, guess what, you really don’t have any other choice…”

    Another thing – when they say they can’t afford Universal Healthcare? They’re lying.

    Access to affordable healthcare is hardly an unattainable goal. On the contrary, there are a lot of countries with significantly lower GDP than the US that can afford such a system yet every time someone talks of introducing it into the good ol’ US of A. they go back to that tired old cliché of “it’s too expensive”, we don’t know where to get the money…

    Really? How about those nice new aircraft the Air Force’s been buying at US$150 million per unit? Do you really need 2,400 of them? Or those nuclear attack submarines which cost $1.8 billion each? Are you sure thirty is the right number, when the Brits make do with 4, the French with 6 and even the Russians (with vastly more land) and the Chinese (with a lot more people) think ten is quite enough to defend their country?

    I’d say that kind of explains where the money went, doesn’t it?

    Sorry, next time you’ll suffer a nasty accident you’ll have to choose either to a) die or b) sell your house and live, but hey, at least no foreign SOB is going to come and kill you, because we have three times more armament than everyone else! (Instead we’ll go kill them where they live)

  23. wingsofwrath

    Heh… I was writing the above wall of text for too long and now JS has beaten me to the punch… Same idea, more concise phrasing. Cheers!

  24. Felonious Punk

    @Blacky: I’m disappointed in your last comment, considering you chose Huey Freeman from ‘Boondocks’ as your avatar. There’s a difference between arguing and fighting. If this discussion devolved into name-calling, I’d agree with you. But a frank exchange of ideas – since it was brought up in the comic that we all enjoy – is what this country was founded on. Dissent built this beautiful country. Don’t shy away from it. Educate yourself, and make your namesake proud.
    @Nicole: I dedicate this rant to you!
    Healthcare in the USA is the 2nd most costly in the world, yet we are THIRTY-SEVENTH in quality! This is according to the World Health Organization – not exactly famous for their socialist leanings. Who’s in the top 10? France is 1st, Italy, San Marino, Andorra, Malta, Singapore, Spain, Oman, Austria and Japan are the top 10. Most Americans probably couldn’t find FIVE of those countries on a globe! But we’re constantly told our country is the best in the world? Do some research on medical tourism: nevermind individuals traveling to foreign countries to get medical procedures performed for less, there are companies whose health plans now outsource the healthcare for their employees to other countries because it’s cheaper – even including airfare and lodging. Still not convinced?
    Let’s look at infant mortality. After all, most of the loudest ‘free-market’ supporters in the US are also vehemently pro-life. Where’s the USA ranked in infant mortality? Oh, wow, look at that. We’re THIRTY-THIRD. Oh my stars, I am just shocked! Who’s in the top 10? Iceland, Singapore, Japan, Sweden, Norway, Hong Kong, Finland, Czech Republic, Switzerland and South Korea. Look at all of those Democratic Socialist nations just utterly conquering us in the health department! Wait, who else is ahead of us – having their newborn babies live while ours die? CUBA! They’re communists, aren’t they? Hey, look at that, the Channel Islands, Brunei, Slovenia, New Caledonia, they’re all ahead of us too!
    Americans who are opposed to universal health care always spout on about ‘the free market’. Look at that top 10. How many of those nations are more socialist than laissez-faire? What truly makes me laugh is how many Americans have been led to believe that ‘the free market’ will set them free, that government regulation will ruin their lives, when in fact it’s the LACK of government regulation that’s keeping them sick, poor, and hungry.
    BTW: All you talk show fans, you may want to learn what socialism REALLY IS before you claim it’s unAmerican. Socialist ideas include public libraries, Social Security, and fire departments (yeah, those 9/11 heroes conservatives love to bring up in conversation – civil service firefighters are a socialist idea.)
    I was raised to believe I live in the greatest country in the world. But since the rights of corporations are placed above those of the people who actually make up this country (and those very same corporations!), we’re allowed to sicken, rot, and die. Why? Because the myth of trickle-down economics STILL prevails. HEALTHY, HAPPY CITIZENS are what’s needed for a strong, successful country. Isn’t that obvious? Isn’t a government supposed to protect its citizens? Shouldn’t that include sickness and disease? Shouldn’t that include predation by money-hungry corporations more concerned with profits than the health of the people they serve and are made up of?
    If avid listeners of talk shows would actually LOOK UP SOME FACTS instead of just parroting what they’re told by the radio and TV, our country would be in much better shape. But no, it’s much easier to mimic what other people tell you than do some research.
    C’mon, this is America! Nobody REALLY wants to look at all those numbers and read all those words? That’s too much work! Just bringing these topics up in conversation is frowned upon! Statistics?! What are you, some kind of geek? Let’s just talk about the game, while our teeth fall out, our parents die of organ failure, and our kids inherit a third-world country.

  25. JS

    Wow, Alison, you’ve really set the bear among the pigeons this time out. :D

    I need one of those snow cones.

  26. wingsofwrath

    @Nicole … as an afterthought, since there seem to be a lot of misconceptions about freedom in the US: In what way are you, as a citizen of the United States of America, more free than me, a citizen of the European Union?
    what is it that you can do and we can’t that is worth the risk of having “your ship go down” without a proper Healthcare System in place to keep it from foundering?

  27. Blacky Blackerson

    @Felonious Punk: Still learning on governmental terms (AP Government is my next step) and I come from a generation that people will fight you if you so called looked at them in a way they don’t like; so what I assumed was anger might have been a debate. Again, I’m still pretty young and, even though I know a little about health care, I still have much to learn. Not to mention the worse I have to worry about is if I pass the ACT or if I have all my credits. Oh, and if you want something Huey Freeman: “Jesus was Black, Ronald Regan is the devil, and the government is lying about 9/11!”

    @JS: Ah, Touche. I want my snow cone Triple-Sec flavored XD.

    @Nicole: LOL ROFL Touche! I guess it just depends on the view of certain people.

    Wow, maybe Alison was right. Politics wouldn’t be a fun route for this comic *sigh*. But who knows, could happen and it could just be fun.

  28. grant N

    Well last post for me on this one. I will admit my grammer and spelling sucks, most of the time I preface my posts with that but been in a hurry last couple of mornings since I am doing a double set of Farm chores while the parents are away. It has been a learning experiance reading the reply posts and chuckling to myself while people call me out. But thats what I really love the freedom to express ourselves and the freedom to vote that expresstion. I do pity the poor bastards in the middle east and africa that are getting killed to obtain that. I guess government run healthcare is just one of those topics that has that line in the sand much like the Abortion, Immagration, and the Need for Millitary Might where I am on one side and you are on the other. That being said see ya in the future commit threads if somthing sparks my interest.

  29. Nicole

    Hi, loves! Well, I just read all of this and really don’t know who to respond to, so I’ll keep it short since you all are on the same track. I totally agree that if we cut military spending, there would be more money for health care. I don’t question that and would be supportive of the exchange.

    For the record, I don’t have cable or satellite, so I’m not a “talk show” watcher that some seem to assume I am. I don’t like the Fox newsies or the MSNBCers because they’re money-grubbing fearmongers. I do not assume that I am “more free” than someone from a country where they have free health care, but I do believe I pay a lot less taxes (and I could be totally wrong on that). I work hard every day for the money I earn and I prefer to keep the majority of it.

    I don’t believe it is the government’s job to make sure I am happy, nor that I stay alive. Humans have a 100% mortality rate. We will all potentially suffer and we will all assuredly die. But, listen, I’m happy to see my culture change when it comes to health care, I’d just rather the government find the money elsewhere (yes, less military spending!) rather than taxing the hell out of my hard-earned dollars…and, yes, I’m single and middle-class so I’m already among those that bear the bulk of the tax burden.

    But really, thank you for the differering points of view. It always makes me think and I really appreciate it.

  30. Ratapoil

    I’m not by any means nearly as judgemental as Grant N. I just said I found his view simplistic (“I make a lot of money so I’m successful and I pay to taxes so the poor take advantage of it and public health care would be too expensive and ripping off the successful people”) and judgemental (condescending vew of the poorer, even almost claiming he pays for their cigarettes, and saying people in washington are morons) and I said something about the imperialistic US army. What’s so judgemental in that?

  31. Lori

    How I handled the price of having a preemie was this: let the hospital do as they wished/insisted, then cried on the phone to the insurance that I didn’t have a choice in any of it, including doctors and tests that they didn’t want to cover but were finally forced to. Of course this was ’96, laws have undoubtedly changed since then. Best of luck with your twins, your pregnancy, life in general. :)

  32. Fionartan

    Uh… you do realize that you’re agreeing with a kid that was dumb enough that he didn’t know what the word “German” meant?

    I’ll agree that our healthcare system is a bit screwed up. I currently don’t HAVE health insurance since my employer decided she’d no longer cover us. -_- That pisses me off… but I haven’t been looking around for a good policy to replace it. If anything catastrophic happens, I’ll be completely effed, but luckily I’m not one that’s easily injured or ill. I have to start looking soon though… or find another job.

    Or a spouse. XD Then I could be on his insurance.

    That’s not going to happen, so I’ll just find my own and save up enough to deal with the crappy coverage.

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